How do you know when one should move up?

Discussion in 'PORTLAND AREA Dart Association (PADA)' started by LuckyDart, Jan 19, 2010.

  1. LuckyDart

    LuckyDart New Member

    I've been playing this game for years. I currently play in the B Division. The competition is great in B so don't get me wrong. I try to keep in mind that everyone is a great player. When I play someone that is on their game my game gets a lot better. I really don't think it matters to me what level of a player I'm up against. However someone shooting a bad game can throw my game off and then i end up losing to them. lol

    let me know what made you decide to move up. I would really like to know how others made their decision. :?
  2. Chitown599

    Chitown599 Administrator Staff Member Site Admin Site Moderator

    As the old saying goes, you play up, or down to your competition. If you find you are struggling more than usual in the B division, than chances are you need to move up to A.
    Most people seem to concentrate more, when they play people who are equal, or better than them, and you seem to be no exception. You elevate your game, when playing higher level players.
    With the exception of 2 seasons, I have always played in the highest level, due to the fact I knew I would learn more there, than playing in a lower division.
    I took my lumps, but as the weeks passed, I was handing out more lumps, than receiving them. And it was all because of the high level of play. No easy games, and if there was, they were very few, and far between, so you had to shoot, or get off the oche, sort of speak. :lol:
    So I would advise you to move up, and see how you do for a season. You may find out, you should have made the switch years ago.
  3. BlackHorse

    BlackHorse Moderator Site Moderator

    The main team league I play in has two Divisions. The decision you talk about isn't clear cut in this league because many people play with their friends regardless of their skill level. The B Division currently has at least ten shooters who should be in A Division, based on their play over several years. Okay, one of the top ones was demoted with his team and isn't there by choice, he knows he's an A player.

    If you are winning the majority of your singles games and shooting well overall in B Division, you should try A, like Chi says. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. I, myself, have a strong aversion to going where I don't belong, so I had to prove that I was worthy of that trial.... when I tied for the singles title in B, even my low self esteem had to shut up, lol, and I moved to A.

    If team leagues only consisted of team play, I wouldn't question where individuals play. But when there are six singles games in the match, I feel strongly that if you are a superior player, you should get up to A. I hate skilled players beating up on people who are less serious about the game or who are out more for general fun than dart prowess. There certainly is no honour in many of those victories.

    I would like to see an A Division full of A Division players, and less skilled shooters in B. I would like to see competition as evenly matched as possible.

    If the skill level is similar in your two divisions, then it might not matter. Is that what you mean by "The competition is great in B" ? If it is, then the choice isn't so important. But if you are continually coming up against people who don't really offer you a challenge, then move on up.

    As for other people's opinions..... I have been told many times that I undervalue my skill, but I have also been ridiculed for going to tournaments where I was told I didn't belong, and judged as being too full of myself. I can't be both, lol - the point being, don't worry about what others think, there are jerks all around. Consider what is best for your game, your enjoyment and satisfaction and, to some extent, your opponents' situation. If any of those suggest at least a trial in A is worth a shot, then definitely do it.
  4. Thorn

    Thorn New Member

    There's not a lot of difference in ability between a good B player and a decent A player in the PADA. I say move up if you want...but unless your team won the B division, and gets the automatic upgrade to A, you're going to have to find an A team with an opening, or get some known A players to join your team and then convince the league board that, overall, you are an A team, that would be unfairly dominant in the B league...

    Maybe these guys could use a fifth...


    I say go for it LuckyDart, test yourself at the next level...
  5. LuckyDart

    LuckyDart New Member

    We have 2 divisions of C, 2 Divisions of B, 2 of A, and 1 AA. There are Ringers in every division. I am going into my fourth season of league. League has really changed my view of how the game can be played. I had always played in tournaments and have beat every level of player. Our B league is very competitive because it has every level of player. I don't know if A is the same. I am starting to feel like I am not improving because of the inconsistency of level of players. what is said is, "B players are beer drinkers whom like to play darts, A are Dart players whom like to drink beer".
    I guess I need to ask more questions. lol

    I'm just trying to figure out where I need to be so I can improve. :lol:

    Thank you for the input, it has answered questions and raised questions for me. :)

    Keep the views coming I need all the ideas I can get.

    Are those guys still
  6. rob

    rob New Member

    there is only one question to ask yourself...
    do you want to get better?

    if yes then play UP into A... you will find there isnt much of a difference other than consistency....
  7. LuckyDart

    LuckyDart New Member

    I just thought about this and I don't know if this should be a different topic but o well.....

    I read that 6'1 1/4" is the ideal height for a dart player... I am 6'1" I do notice that it takes less effort for me to throw my dart when I'm wearing my shoes with the higher sole. My girl friend is 5' 3". so if she stands on a box would anyone care or is there a rule about this? :lol: :lol:
  8. BlackHorse

    BlackHorse Moderator Site Moderator

    You are tall, a very good shot and have a dart-playing girlfriend. I am too jealous to offer you any more help. :p

  9. LuckyDart

    LuckyDart New Member

    lol :lol: .... you've been a big help blackhorse :D Thanks
  10. Thorn

    Thorn New Member

    I think the height thing is hooey LuckyDart.

    Let me put the difference another way, between A and B in the PADA. And you're right, both divisions have lots of solid players. The main difference that I see, is that most A players know their outs and strategy. B players often do not. This to me, is a big difference, and can raise or lower your winning percentage a good 10 to 20 percent...

    If you know your outs, and your higher level cricket strategy, and you think you can throw a 4count or more every couple turns, by all means, jump into A...
  11. CannonFodder

    CannonFodder New Member

    Of course PADA is run differently than the league I'm in. We play all in one division in the fall and split the top half into A and the bottom half into B for the Spring semester. We currently have 8 teams. 3 of the teams are stacked and the 4'th team have traditionally been obvious to make it as well.
    Anyway, the last 2 months, I've been playing pretty well and my team-mates have stepped up as well. Did not think about our position, but everybody else on the team was looking forward to play in the B league in the spring. Well, we won a big one last Wednesday (last day of fall league) and was happy with our exit efforts.

    Well, on Sunday, I came to know that we actually racked up enough points to bring us into 4'th place in the league 8O And that I seem to have won the men's ton league with 9, yes nine points (in tons score additions in the fall!) from the best in the strongest team. Ha, ha!

    So, It will be me and 3 girls (Witchy Women and a Warlock) going into the A bracket to fight the 3 ringer teams with at least 5-6 people on the revenge path!! I know the girls will be non-to-pleased about this situation :lol: :lol: It's going to be a bumpy ride, but I'm personally really frikkin' looking forward to it! :twisted:
  12. CraigB

    CraigB Best looking Craig B in the forum! $:-{P> Staff Member Site Admin

    If you're even considering moving up to improve your darts than you should.

    My first season of darts (over 25 years ago) was in the second-highest division down in So. Cal., the very next season I moved up to the highest division and, a few dart leagues later, I'm still there.

    (Proud member of the only dart team of ringers that can't be moved up! :twisted: )
  13. ChristinaO

    ChristinaO New Member

    I know, I have a great idea (IMO)!! Not my place but I have a GREAT idea for the team of ringers that can't be moved up.... How about that team divides itself in half and picks up other A-B Players and mentors them for a couple of seasons creating two maybe even three more A Division Teams??

    Maybe it would create more competition for those "ringers that can't be moved up"??

    Just my thought... :p
  14. CraigB

    CraigB Best looking Craig B in the forum! $:-{P> Staff Member Site Admin

    Great idea! Let's make all teams equal so no one will ever want to get better and everything is bland!

    Sorry for the sarcasm C, but real competition doesn't work like that (in fact it kills it) and that team of so-called "ringers" (a joke waiting for Andy to chime in on) has been made up of, what, half-a-dozen lineups so far and has worked hard to get where we are.

    It does make me wonder what the PDC would be like if Phil had backed off after three or four championships just to make things a bit fairer though...
  15. SOUPR

    SOUPR New Member

    Not what I would call ringers, just a group of good players, Luckily able to play regardless of working schedules.

    Currently "MY" old team is broken up into 2 teams.
    As you recall we did quite well against your ringers.

    You knew I could'nt leave that one just hanging out there Craig......
  16. SOUPR

    SOUPR New Member

    Craig, What Christina does not realize is that when the Team that is on top, you do not break them up just to make it easier for the other teams to win. They need to find a way to play better, get better players and just win.

    I believe we do not want the "Little League" mentality of everyone wins, and everyone gets a trophy.

    This is not rocket science, just playing darts.
    Put together your best team and come play.
    I believe that says it all.

    That may sound mean....................Sorry thats just me.
    OK, not really sorry.
  17. CraigB

    CraigB Best looking Craig B in the forum! $:-{P> Staff Member Site Admin

    Exactly! What makes us winners is that we play well as a team.

    My darts have definitely suffered thanks to my current home situation (except in the playoffs - heh!) and Gregg has never been a top dog, but we've done well with whatever combination of two others that we've played with (Jim Carsner, Jake Scott, Chris Ricci, Alan Poole or even Kent and Phil).

    When Allen (Nutter) put together his "ringer" team a few years ago, we got our butts kicked 44 to 5 (under the old format). The next time we played them (still with Kent and Phil) we missed going to the tie-breaker by one bullseye (and a team member had three darts at that). The third time we played them (the next season with a slightly revised line-up) we finally beat them and didn't lose to them again until they quit the league. Instead of considering them too tough (or, worse, that they should break themselves up), we just kept working on our games and got better as a team. Needless to say, the feeling of accomplishment was great and that's why I recommended that anyone considering moving up to do it - even if you get wiped out the first few times.

    Hopefully you'll have time to play for the Spring season Andy! :)
  18. Thorn

    Thorn New Member

    I think you're wrong about the ringer thing too CO. I'm not that great and I've beaten up* on two of CB's teammates once or twice before. And I've carried Craig in shoots before. :wink: :lol:

    Seriously though, I think CB's team is an awesome group of guys, let alone throwers I emulate. And I look forward to the honor of meeting or playing with the one I've never met. And SOUPR too does great things to spread the game and develop talent in new players. And of course you too CO--if you're reputation for the game didn't precede you, it'd be easier to thank you with a hug. :wink:

    You guys are all current or former board members. And, I really appreciate the chance to hear you're thoughts on the future of the league and how to format it. Thanks for sharin'...

    But as just a player in the league--and I hang out with several of the newer board members and hear their thoughts too, and they're busy preparing for the spring session--but, my assessment is: I think things are more or less "fine" the way they are. More or less. I think no matter what, some players or teams will not get all the stars to align every season, and the fun part is, winning anyway. Or at least trying to... :D

    Over and double out!
    *by "beaten up" I meant "went .500" against, which obviously was success to me. hehe.

    (LuckyDart, move up if you want! Whatever you choose, good luck, and enjoy)
  19. ChristinaO

    ChristinaO New Member

    Hmmm, guess my sarcasm was completely misunderstood... I wasn't implying splitting the team up to make things easier for others to win, my intent was to create an opportunity for the guys at the top levels in PADA to coach and mentor those players that are wanting to learn and move up the league, thus creating more competition.

    I've been reminded why it is best for me to keep my ideas to myself... So, instead of any ideas; how guys have a great season.
  20. Thorn

    Thorn New Member

    I like that thought a lot CO--I liked it before too (although I didn't actually catch the sarcastic part--I hope everyone understood my sarcasm! yikes!). You know I'm with that philosophy, in general. And there are people I know that sorta go 'free-agent' in the league, often developing new players or teams--kudos to them--and I think it would naturally happen even more as the league grows in membership, allowing a broader spectrum of talent to blend a bit more equitably in each division, and more or bigger divisions...

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